In my relatively short tenure in the blogging world, I’ve been fortunate to come across some really good people.  One of them I actually met after purchasing his WordPress theme, FrugalTheme.  His name is Eric Hamm, and his story is an interesting one if you are a blogger or not.  If you’ve ever considered making a living online this interview is definitely for you.  Eric was nice enough to thoroughly answer a number of questions I posed to him.  So let’s get right to the interview.

When did you first get involved in the blogging world and why?

July 21st, 2008, I wrote my first post on my personal blog Motivate Thyself.  It was just a week or so before the publishing of that post that I started thinking about starting a blog and maybe even an online business.

I have found this to be common with new bloggers.  They either get into it for pure pleasure or with the intent of making money and even better, a living.  I was in the latter crowd and the idea of making a living online was what drove me to really get into it and see what I could do.  It was only a few months later that I realized that it wasn’t going to be easy.

I recently purchased the FrugalTheme which was developed by you.  What was the motivation for developing your own WordPress theme?

My first real success in making a living online was through my WordPress Web Design Business (which later became a place to help promote frugalTheme.com).  I quickly found a great venue for advertising (I was the first to enjoy Leo’s new ad setup where he only displays a single ad a month and got TONS of traffic from it) and hit the ground running.  Within a week I had more business than I knew what to do with.

One problem I kept running into was that all the themes I had on hand were lacking in one way or another.  I wanted just one theme to house all the features and coding that allowed me the most efficient design experience.  After searching for and buying many different themes I finally decided that I just needed to create my own.  I had been playing with the idea of creating my own WordPress theme for some time so I was ready to dive in right away.

After a few weeks of long hours (trying to develop a new WordPress theme on top of tending to my current design clients) I came up with frugal.  It was very basic and super clean and perfect for what I was going for.  What I found, though, was that people became more interested in the theme itself.  They’d ask about it and where they could get it.  So I created the frugalTheme.com domain and made frugal a free download.  Within a month or so it had been downloaded thousands of times.  It was then that I realized I could actually make money off the thing.

The free version was very basic and offered few options to the user.  So I created a Premium Version that gave the user tons of design control over their WordPress website and charged for it.  Within a month I was making a living just off of theme sales and decided to close shop with the design biz and move all my attention over to the further development of frugal (I MUCH preferred the sales business model over services as I had just spent 5 years working as an independent computer consultant in my home town and had become quite sick of the “only make money while actually working” model).

Do you plan on developing more themes in the future?

At this point I don’t plan on developing anymore themes, though I am working on some other WordPress projects that aren’t quite in the ‘themes’ category.  But frugal is really meant to be a framework or blank canvas and therefore require no other themes.  In other words, the whole point of frugal is to give the user a WordPress theme that can be molded into whatever they want.  So creating another theme would kind of go against this idea.

With that being said, I think there’s still a place for pre-customized themes that give the user a nice and shiny theme right out of the box.  The problem with this kind of theme is that when you want to make it look like something else you run into a lot of trouble trying to un-customize the thing.  This is why you find that ‘WP Themes’ folder on our computer desktops filled with 500 themes, one for every possible occasion.  frugal is meant to help clean that mess up.

But who knows, I may find a reason to create a different theme one day. **covering all my bases**

I blog but I also have another full-time job. Is this your situation as well or is blogging and developing themes a full-time gig for you?

I can happily say that I work full time online.  I have many streams of online income, but frugal is definitely my main one.

As I mentioned before, for 5 years I had a computer consulting business which was a full time gig, so even then I didn’t work for anyone else (I’m not a fan of J-O-B’s), but it’s now been a year since I moved fully online.

(Just because I think others may be interested in knowing, my other streams of income are (in order of significance) ebooks sales, monthly income from the sale of my computer business and affiliate sales.)

Tell us a little about your blog MotivateThyself.com.  How did it evolve?

As I mentioned earlier, Motivate Thyself is my personal blog and the first one I started.  The subject came about with my passion for living life to the fullest and doing what I want (not letting the world around me dictate this).  As I said, I’m not a fan of working for others so I’ve always had to work my butt off to steer clear of that ‘daily grind’.

The blog/website itself has been a fairly popular personal development spot, but has certainly gone through its ups and downs based on my effort.  It quickly grew from the get go as I was able to connect with some bigger bloggers and get some solid guest posts out so larger audiences could get a taste of my writing style and content.  But once I started working on web design and later frugal I had to significantly decrease my post frequency.

How did Motivate Thyself evolve?  I would say it started out as a passionate blog about making the most of your life and then became a bit more personal as time went on.  I’ve written posts about my dad who died way too young, my mom who remarried and about me, my son Tyson and my relationship with my beautiful wife Liz.  But I still stick to those core concepts of being truly successful and changing your life.

If you go to your MotivateThyself.com site and click on “The Book” it appears that you have written a book with Leo Babauta of ZenHabits.  That’s great company! How did this collaboration come about?

First, let me just say that Leo is one of the nicest, most genuine individuals I’ve found online.  The guy is freaking awesome!   He’s got a huge family and still finds time to do all that he’s done online while maintaining a great attitude.

Like many other personal development bloggers who started blogging after Leo, I saw zenhabits as a super successful blog to model and find inspiration from.  So I naturally became a regular reader.  One day, Leo emailed me to see if I could help someone with a WordPress issue and if I’d like to submit a guest post for zenhabits, which I happily did.  I later helped him with a few things on zenhabits and eventually we talked about doing a book about motivation.  But during the months in between we just became friends.  Like I said, a great guy.

If you were to give some advice to a new blogger what would you tell them?

It really depends on their online goals.  If they are just blogging for pure pleasure then it’s really just a matter of having fun with it.  Don’t let yourself get sucked into trying to figure out what the ‘right’ way to do things.  There really just isn’t a model that trumps all others.  But even for pleasure purposes you can’t have fun without an audience so there are certainly things you can/should do to attract that audience.

Yet, if you’re really trying to bring home the bacon the tips and tricks are similar, but the mindset is totally different.  You’ve really got to think of your blog as a business and treat it as such.  Just like work you won’t always want to do it.  Just like work you’ll have to keep some kind of schedule and just like a business, if you want to succeed you have to work harder and smarter than the next guy.

With that being said, here are a few tips:

• Pay for a basic web server (they’re like $80/yr, but totally worth it) and then find a WordPress theme that will give you blog the look, feel and function that you need to be successful.  Whether you purchase a Premium theme (usually the best idea) or can find a free one that can pull this off, the skin of your WordPress website is a key ingredient to blogging success as it not only provided the first impression, but is basically the window your visitors look through to ingest your content.
• Domain name DOES matter.  Sure there are some successful blogs out there with crappy domain names, but they are this way in spite of the name, not because of.  Fairly short, easy to type and remember and keyword right is good to.
• Guest post, guest post, guest post! There’s not better way to get a boost in traffic, subscribers and page rank than to guest post on blogs bigger (preferably MUCH bigger) than your own.  And tip about what to submit: When you’ve written something that is so good that you feel jealous about giving it to another blog, then it’s ready to submit.  If you don’t feel like you’re giving a part of yourself to that blog then it’s probably not going to translate well to their readers.
• Keep an eye out for a blogging buddy.  Blogging is hard enough, but doing it alone is near impossible.  You may have a local friend or spouse, but they can only empathize but so much and probably won’t be much help tactically.  Sean Platt is one of mine and we’ve worked on or help each other with many online projects.  Without Sean I probably would have given up a while back.
• Find resources that you can best connect with.  There are many different sites out there to help you become better bloggers, but each one has its own style and personality.  So don’t just read the one everyone else is reading.  Keep looking until you find that resource that specifically speaks to YOU.  ProBlogger, though, is a great place to start.
• HAVE FUN!! OK, this is that over done, over simplified blogging tip, but hey, it’s true.  You won’t always enjoy blogging, but if you can’t find ways to enjoy this time consuming online pursuit you’re going to quit and quitting is what most people do and why most never succeed.  Here’s a picture of Sean and I having some fun.  Who knew we’d first physically meet in Vegas?!

I recently interviewed Jonathan Fields, and he is a living breathing example of someone prospering in the new economy.  Can you speak a little about making a living in the electronic age and the opportunities that are out there?

Let me first say that this IS a new economy, no doubt about it.  We were headed this way already, but the recent economic woes just sped up the process and pushed people in this new direction.  What I absolutely LOVE about it is that the playing field has been effectively leveled so ANYONE can find success online.  This, though, is the problem for most.  Just about everyone is trying to find this online success so the task of standing out from the crowd is quite a feat.

That being said, there are new online opportunities arising on a daily basis so if you want the freedom of making a living online GO FOR IT!!

Now, for the practical bit.  I quickly found with the blogging idea that just creating great content and putting up some ads will rarely make you much money.  For most, it’s the behind the scenes stuff that offers the real opportunities.  It’s kind of like moving to Hollywood to become an actor.  A few find fame while most end up either waiting tables for much longer than they expected or they adapt their other skills to make a living in the background.  Editing film, lighting, props, etc…  This allows them to hang around longer while they keep an eye out for their real passions.  Then, they hopefully either become ‘discovered’ actors or they realize that some of the greatest opportunities ARE behind the scenes.

After make very little purely blogging I found that my technical skills could be adapted to help other with their own blogs.  This morphed into frugal and now I’m doing something I really enjoy.  And the cool thing is that every success you have you’ll find 5 new doors opened as a result.  As time goes on you’re choices broaden.  So don’t worry too much about what you have to do in the beginning of your online journey.  Be steadfast and you will find success, grasshopper.

The support you offer with the FrugalTheme, in my opinion, is unparalleled.  Can you tell me what your philosophy is when it comes to customer support?

Thanks Bob!  That means a lot.

I’m actually a super people pleaser (yes, I even have a link for that and this really plays into my support for frugal.  I enjoy helping people and seeing them succeed.  So frugal support is just an extension of this.

As far as my philosophy with frugal support, I simply base my support on whether or not I CAN help someone, not whether I SHOULD.  In other words, there are many times when the request for my assistance reaches way outside of the zone of frugal specific.  Here is where I feel I can distance myself from the competition.  I do my best to lend a hand, at this point as more of a fellow online citizen (sounds corny, I know).  But I do draw the line when I have to as I need to spend my time developing and promoting as well.

Logistically, I know people learn differently so I try to teach as adaptively as possible.  I provide video tutorials, blog posts and direct support via the frugal forum and email.

One more blogging question for you.  Could you talk a little about monetizing a blog?  For those of us who recently began blogging there appear to be so many options out there as far as monetizing is concerned. What is your take on monetizing a blog?

I’ve already mentioned some specific forms of monetization for myself, but I’d be happy to speak in more general terms.

There are a million ways to make money online and only some come from blogging.  I often find that most of the money made from bloggers is done indirectly from their blogs.  Blogs make great billboards (or email absorbers…newsletters), but not always the best store fronts.  I mean, I know technically a lot of store fronts are blogs as well (ie. frugalTheme.com), but when someone asks me what my blog is I mention Motivate Thyself.  It has way more posts, subscribers and purely blogging traffic, yet I make zero money directly from it.  Also, a successful blog (in terms of traffic and reputation) can make you money by just opening doors and creating connections that wouldn’t otherwise be there.

You can make money from Adsense, affiliate advertising, offering a product or service of your own and so on.  Just be smart about it.  If you’re promoting as an affiliate, make sure you have personal experience with that product or service.  Write posts about that experience (reviews) and never promote something you don’t fully believe in.

But when it comes to making real bill paying income you either need tons of traffic to funnel to your ads or a product or service of your own to promote which you receive full payment for.  In other words, 25% of something requires 4 times as much traffic to profit equally from when compared to something you receive 100% for.  And if you can match that tons of traffic with your own product you’re in the zone!

Just know that it takes time.  I didn’t start making real money for a good 6 months and I think my situation went quite quickly when compared to most.  You’re going to need some source of income in the mean time.  If you quit your job and try to live off savings for a few months, banking on finding instant success, you’re going to be quite disappointed.  Also, you’ll be making decisions based on what’s quickest, not what’s the best way to go for the long term.

One thing I have to mention when trying to monetize.  Traffic and comments means jack squat if they’re not in some way followed by dollar signs.  It’s very easy to get caught up with how many comments you get each post, for example, but bloggers notoriously comment for links and such.  So it’s absolutely crucial that you find some way to capture a direct connection with that audience so you can promote to them more effectively.  That’s where newsletters come in.

When I started blogging I’d see free products attached to newsletter signups on so many blogs.  I thought it was gimmicky and figured people would get annoyed with it (as if it were tacky to ask for an email).  Later I realized that having a growing list of emails of individuals who are interested in the topic of your content is a powerful tool for making money online.  Just provide an enticing reason for signup and an effective plan to promote and you’re on your way.

Hey Bob, I just wanted to say thanks for inviting me to come to your blog and share my thoughts with your readers.  You’re a great guy behind the scenes and I know your online endeavors will benefit as a result.

End of Interview

I want to thank Eric Hamm for his thorough and insightful answers to the questions I posed.  You can certainly do no wrong in following his advice if you are looking to make your living online.  As I said earlier in this post, I have been extremely fortunate to have met some very good people in the blogging world.  After having gotten to know Eric a little better, his story is certainly the antithesis of the quote “Nice guys finish last.”  Thanks again Eric!

[Disclosure - I purchased the FrugalTheme prior to knowing Eric and I have since become an affiliate.  The link for FrugalTheme at the top of my right sidebar is an affiliate link.  Eric is a great guy and you cannot go wrong in purchasing his theme.  And, if I failed to mention it, his support rocks!]

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3. Why I left SquareSpace for WordPress.

I have never had the pleasure of meeting Jonathan Fields face-to-face but I think I know a little bit about him.  I read his book, Career Renegade, a couple of times.  I also reviewed it in this post.  I have exchanged emails with him a few times and he has been very gracious to respond to me.  I also read his blog regularly because it is one of the most thought-provoking blogs I have found in the blogosphere.  If you do not know his story, maybe you should.  Just go visit his blog and go to the sidebar and download the first four chapters of his book, Career Renegade, for free.  You will get to know a fascinating, dynamic person who has a compassion and a spirit that will touch you as he has me.

After I read his book, I emailed Jonathan telling him that I was planning on reviewing the book on my blog and I would appreciate it if he could answer a few questions that sprung from reading the book.  He was very gracious that I had decided to review his book but he didn’t have time, at that time, to answer the questions thoroughly enough.  He did say he would do so when he had the proper time to devote to answering the questions.  Being a man of his word, Jonathan recently surprised me with a long email with all of my questions answered.  I am happy to be able to share these answers with all of you.

The Interview

Jonathan, one of my favorite quotes in the book is when you speak to the best part about being an entrepreneur.  It is the luxury of being able to hand-pick the people you want to work with.  You say, “It’s all about the Benjamins, not the benjamins”.  What a priceless quote.  This seems to follow along with one of your original goals which was to “Be around people I loved”. Have there been times when you have had to compromise on this premise in the interest of making a good business deal?

Jonathan Fields:

Sure, there’ve been many times I’ve been offered a shot at a business deal of a serious chunk of money that would have taken me farther away from my desire to surround myself with people who make me come alive. But, you learn pretty quickly, the money’s not worth the sacrifice. Because life–work and play–are fundamentally about the people you work, mentor with and serve. If they’re “your” people, you can tolerate ebbs and flows in the other qualities of work you hold dear. If not, no amount of money will make up for the experience of being surrounded, day in and day out, by people who incrementally suck the life out of you.

You talk about the power of “flow” where you are fully engaged in the world and in the moment. Reading this book and in reading your blogs, I sense that when you write you are so engaged. Do you still feel the power of “flow” on a daily basis or is it sporadic and are there certain times and places where you tend to get in the “zone”?

Jonathan Fields:

I wish I could say I drop into the flow zone every time I write, but I’d be lying. It tends to happen when I’m writing about things I’m deeply passionate about. When I drop the shields and filters and let my emotions perfuse the words. It’s almost like I’m in a mad dash, praying my fingers can keep pace with the thoughts and ideas that tumble forth. When that happens, day could turn to night without me realizing. And, writing is a gift. It’s not just writing that does that for me, though. I love to create…anything and everything. From business ventures to books, art, music, presentations, it’s all part of what I do and the diversity of outlets provides for frequent opportunities for flow.

You run two very successful blogs, one at JonathanFields.com and CareerRenegade.com. If you could give some sage words of advice to anyone who is just starting out in the blogging world what would you tell them?

Jonathan Fields:

I actually recently merged the blog part of CareerRenegade.com into JonathanFields.com in order to allow me to focus my energies more. Simple advice, pick a topic you’d write, speak or film videos about for free for the rest of your life, simply because it’s that much fun for you. It takes a huge effort to sustain an online content platform over time and, in order to do it well, you need to be captivated by the subject of your content or you’ll burn out and shut down.

In your blogs you talk a lot about having the freedom with your lifestyle to spend time with your young daughter. As a father of two daughters who are now older it was always a struggle for me to spend enough time with them when they were young. Can you elaborate a bit on what it’s like, as a Career Renegade, to be able to spend so much quality time with her?

Jonathan Fields:

It’s everything. I sometimes sit across the table and just watch her while we’re painting or working on a craft together or even just reading or hanging out. Wondering what’s going through her mind, marveling at who she is and wondering who she’ll become. I think most people get it seriously wrong, they slave away at work in order to pay for college during the years when kids need and want them in their lives most, then pull back from work when their kids are most autonomous.

You’ve got a whole life to work, but your kid’s only going to be 7 or 8 once. Being strongly present for the first 16 of their lives matters just as much and probably a lot more than the name of the college they get into. Maybe I feel this way, too, because being so present has revealed to me just how much I’d have missed were I not there. I get the struggle, really I do. I still constantly strive to find my place in it. I’ve just made a different choice than most.

To me, being a parent is about presence, not presents. And, with the evolution of technology over just the last 5 years, being present has become easier than ever before…if that’s your priority.

On September 10, 2001 you signed a lease for what would become SonicYoga NYC, the first Manhattan studio. This was one day before the tragic September 11th attacks on the Twin Towers. I’m wondering what effect, if any, the attacks had on you starting the business. Also, did you have any friends or associates who were either lost or affected by the tragedy?

Jonathan Fields:

Yes, I knew people who were killed that day, as did pretty much anyone who’d been living in NYC for more than a few years. And, it affected me deeply, both because of an experience I had working 10 feet from “The Pile” a few days after the tower fell and what unfolded in the week that followed.

I remember being in a friend’s home the next day, a young dad, as his wife wondered and still hoped for his return (that would never come). I remember everyone else leaving as she and my wife put their 9 month old to bed and I was asked to read a story to their 2 1/2 year old boy. I remember walking into his room, a virtual stranger to him, seeing him sitting upright, legs snuggled in his covers, book on his lap, gazing up and wondering why I, and not his daddy, was reading him to sleep that night.

So, yes, it absolutely had an impact on me and on the business I was about to launch. I’d planned all sorts of marketing events, parties and messages. Everything had to change overnight. I had to figure out how to launch a company into a city whose economy was crashing and burning. I had to explore how to build a business that put food on the table for my own family, while being respectful to the sense of loss that blanketed the city. But what I realized, too, was that the city needed what I was about to offer more than ever before.

The pier where many of the relief workers were staging was only a few blocks from us, so when we opened, we sent people out to let everyone know they could come by the studio for class, meditation or just to be in a peaceful place without paying anything. It was just the right thing to do, from both a human standpoint as well as from a business standpoint. The studio grew very quickly, I believe, in no small part, because of the intention we put out into the community. And as the energy in the city began to shift, we slowly evolved and took on a more upbeat, energetic tone that captured who we were, without disrespecting what’d happened in the city. That first year was truly an extraordinary experience on so many levels. Not one I’d want to relive, but one I’m glad I survived.

Conclusion of Interview

I want to thank Jonathan Fields for his thorough, thoughtful answers to the questions I posed. I knew they all wouldn’t be easy ones to answer, especially the one about September 11th.  But Jonathan, in his typical candor, gave all of us readers a little insight into a day that most of us thankfully did not have to witness first-hand.  More importantly, we were able to learn a little bit more about a man who has been able to live out his dreams as an entrepreneur, a father, and a husband.

Jonathan is known for his morning Tweets that say “Morning, everyone! Who can I help today?” Well, whoever it is, on any given day, that person will be well served by listening to a man whose sheer intellect and business acumen may be overshadowed by his warm and generous heart.

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Related posts:

1. Interview with FrugalTheme creator, Eric Hamm.
2. Career Renegade: a book review.
3. A little history and coming attractions…

Related posts:

1. Interview with Jonathan Fields.
2. Review of Daniel Scocco’s eBook, Make Money Blogging.
3. Interview with FrugalTheme creator, Eric Hamm.

We’re all about success here at TotallyUniqueLife.com and, if you are going to start looking at successful websites, you have to take a walk on the web and stop at Woot.com.

Woot is an e-commerce site that was founded by electronics wholesaler Matt Rudledge and debuted on July 12, 2004.  The most interesting and creative aspect of this site is that Woot offers one product per day until its stock of that item is sold out or the product is replaced at midnight Central Time with the next offering.  This “One Deal a Day” business model has been copied and implemented many times since Woot was launched back in 2004.

Woot has fostered a “community” environment where users log in and talk about the products they have purchased or would like to purchase.  Obviously, due to the expediency of the buying process on this site, the need for information is paramount. Interaction with other users is extremely helpful in the buying process due to the fact that you have only one day to buy the product.  When a user goes to the Woot home page there is an immediate example of the community atmosphere of the site with a view of today’s discussions.  This site screams “interactivity”  and beckons the visitor to take part in the experience that is Woot.

There is even a section of the home page which shows who the first “sucker” was that purchased that day’s sale item and how long it took that user to make that purchase.

Adding to the customer experience is a Sales Statistics page which shows a number of various statistics related to the purchaser experience, purchased seniority, and quantity breakdown.  The percentage of sales per hour gives a nice breakdown of how the product is selling by hour.

On the Statistics page the user is also presented with a map of where people are buying the product from.

The key to Woot’s success is obviously their creativity  by creating a social atmosphere where the consumer feels like they are part of the user experience.  It is this type of creativity and marketing genius that has made Woot a pioneer site.  Other e-commerce sites, if they haven’t already, can learn a lot from the brilliant marketing strategies of Woot.  Check out Woot and maybe you can incorporate a few of their creative strategies into your site.  Thinking “outside the box” has led to the creation of a “totally unique” site in Woot…

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Related posts:

1. Interview with FrugalTheme creator, Eric Hamm.
2. A Glimpse into 3 Time Management Frameworks
3. How to get your child into their “first choice” college.